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Thread: Petition to nerf the Godslinger

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halcy View Post
    I don't think gunslinger needs a nerf, it's fine as it is now for me
    Watch my video, then you wont ^^
    Or meet me ingame on pts, iŽll show you


    Or do you mean on live servers, cuz yes, there gs is fine. But we are talking about PTS
    http://forums.trovegame.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=22918417&dateline=154  2500093
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  2. #22
    Member Halcy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stenwulf View Post
    Watch my video, then you wont ^^
    Or meet me ingame on pts, iŽll show you


    Or do you mean on live servers, cuz yes, there gs is fine. But we are talking about PTS
    I take that back, I mean on LIVE, it's fine
    But for PTS, I just realized about a certain empowered gem effect that could make gunslinger at a maximum advantage, sorry :P

    I'm up for a nerf then
    IGN: Halcy

  3. #23
    Member smellyalater's Avatar
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    To everyone who are currently wondering if this really needs a nerf, I'd like you to direct your attention to this:


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjUB83K8bxA


    This video was filmed on PTS, which is under heavy load which means timings for each of us were bad, our coeffs weren't perfect, because again it's PTS, some of these people haven't ever speedrun on live and this was rushed together to make a point. EVEN THEN, we made it to a 13.3 sec time, which is just 0.4 the best EVER time on Live.


    Now, yes, we have new gems and yes, it clearly makes a damage difference, but nonetheless, once people max the GS on the new update with this gem and have actual good coefficients, the speedrunning scene will be dead.


    This is why we can't allow this gem through or allow GS to keep the current AS at 300 when ulting.
    --> Stats <-- (Updated 21/01/18)

  4. #24
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    Wouldn't it make more sense to just not have the gem in the game that would affect attack speed? That way it wouldn't make any class using attack speed overpowered.



    Gunslinger without its ult is a pretty useless class for anything else. As long as i can remember it has always been a high DPS class glass cannon.
    There are plenty of various classes that work for certain aspects of the game better than other classes.


    And being end game, what about all the players who are grinding up to the top end? Did we forget what it was like being low powered classes? Try playing gunslinger as a new player and tell me that some more DPS outside of ults wouldn't be helpful.



    I think that many classes really need to be reworked, so players are not picking a specific class for a specific task.


    But that also goes towards ultra towers potentially not being the top tier anymore? I remember someone mentioning that shadow towers would be looked at after U10, along with more class balancing.



    I don't understand how going from a 20 second shadow tower ultra run time, to a 13 second shadow tower ultra run time is terrible. Afterall new tier of weapons, additional gems give more damage. Had it been a UM DOTM one shot, sure i would agree... but a team of 8 shaving down run times 7 seconds with the new tiers of gear/gems...idk.

  5. #25
    Senior Member fruitie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellyalater View Post
    To everyone who are currently wondering if this really needs a nerf, I'd like you to direct your attention to this:


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjUB83K8bxA


    This video was filmed on PTS, which is under heavy load which means timings for each of us were bad, our coeffs weren't perfect, because again it's PTS, some of these people haven't ever speedrun on live and this was rushed together to make a point. EVEN THEN, we made it to a 13.3 sec time, which is just 0.4 the best EVER time on Live.


    Now, yes, we have new gems and yes, it clearly makes a damage difference, but nonetheless, once people max the GS on the new update with this gem and have actual good coefficients, the speedrunning scene will be dead.


    This is why we can't allow this gem through or allow GS to keep the current AS at 300 when ulting.
    So the problem is that you get similar to top time for ultra dotm with 6k extra PR and an extra power? I'm pretty sceptical of the issue, but tbh I'm not going to bother testing it myself since it'll just be a complete waste of time so will let everyone else sort it all out. Still, the PR difference alone would merit around a 20% performance increase. Plus idk what else there is to expect when there are almost no balance changes. I also don't know how speedrunning will any more dead, the same people (presuming they will continue playing) will continue getting top time

  6. #26
    Just buff every single class. ez pizze xd

  7. #27
    Member smellyalater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by High5 View Post
    Wouldn't it make more sense to just not have the gem in the game that would affect attack speed? That way it wouldn't make any class using attack speed overpowered.

    Gunslinger without its ult is a pretty useless class for anything else. As long as i can remember it has always been a high DPS class glass cannon.
    There are plenty of various classes that work for certain aspects of the game better than other classes.

    And being end game, what about all the players who are grinding up to the top end? Did we forget what it was like being low powered classes? Try playing gunslinger as a new player and tell me that some more DPS outside of ults wouldn't be helpful.

    I think that many classes really need to be reworked, so players are not picking a specific class for a specific task.

    But that also goes towards ultra towers potentially not being the top tier anymore? I remember someone mentioning that shadow towers would be looked at after U10, along with more class balancing.

    I don't understand how going from a 20 second shadow tower ultra run time, to a 13 second shadow tower ultra run time is terrible. Afterall new tier of weapons, additional gems give more damage. Had it been a UM DOTM one shot, sure i would agree... but a team of 8 shaving down run times 7 seconds with the new tiers of gear/gems...idk.


    Yes, as Halcy stated, currently the GS on live servers is fine and with the new gems that wouldn't change. The problem is the empowered gem giving it ridiculous attack speed.


    You wouldn't run GS without ult, but I don't see the argument here. If you're refering to "don't let gs ult go over x attack speed" it's because with gs ult your attack speed is lowered, but this gem can still make you cap and GS with capped attack speed while ulting is broken compared to any other class - The only reason why it was mainly removed from speeds was that other classes were getting buffed equally or close to, so the scales were tipping. Since CB is an underpowered class, but had the attack speed buff, it was a worthwhile sacrifice. Not anymore and definitely not if we get this gem that is like a pseudo-CB.


    Low end players can play with GS just fine, I don't think you've played low-tier GS for a while, this problem mainly lies with speedrunning and over all balancing. No one who do not speed would be affected by this gem not being in the game, except they'd shoot a bit slower (aka the same amount as live is rn, which has been plenty to make GS viable for years).


    I agree, classes should be reworked and they are, but this gem is going to smash all that work by making GS about two times better - if we disregard the fact we're getting approx. 33% extra damage when maxed, this is still 66% more damage from the addition of this gem, that is unreal. No other class can compare.


    Not sure about changes in STs, but right now they'd be ruined, fun-wise and competitive-wise - the new GS smashes through everything. All I know is that they haven't buffed HP in STs, which wouldn't have changed the problem anyways, it would just have made the other classes even slower.


    Well, most of us didn't have fixtures, some of the people in that run had never speedrun before, others had the same stats as a high tier GS on live and then there are all the lag issues that comes with running NA (You never do that on live, btw). Not to mention PTS has a lot of traffic right now as well.


    If you take all those points into consideration, shaving off 7 seconds of what used to be a dead meta, by adding a new empowered gem ability is pretty stupid. I agree though, this was a ****ty run and we're gonna get a full team of proper speedrunners and aim for sub10 today to really hammer in the problem here.



    Quote Originally Posted by fruitie View Post
    So the problem is that you get similar to top time for ultra dotm with 6k extra PR and an extra power? I'm pretty sceptical of the issue, but tbh I'm not going to bother testing it myself since it'll just be a complete waste of time so will let everyone else sort it all out. Still, the PR difference alone would merit around a 20% performance increase. Plus idk what else there is to expect when there are almost no balance changes. I also don't know how speedrunning will any more dead, the same people (presuming they will continue playing) will continue getting top time

    I was one of the only players who had maxed the new gems, most of the runners had about 1 mil more coeff from just adding the gem itself and then coming to run. The gems should only add 33% more damage and going by the fact of all the problems I've mentioned in the previous post and above in this one, it's fairly easy to see the problem. Maybe if you don't speed, it's hard to see and I'm sorry for making assumptions, but I guess I did when I made that post.


    PTS-NA - the only PTS server, under heavily load and on NA - No one ever runs NA on live because of lag issues and therefore less damage, because the servers don't pick up info in time, guess how that affects damage on a PTS server with tons of people exporting accounts to it and trying to access it.


    Coefficients - Only two or three of the GS in that run were maxed, none of us used proper new gear if any. the coeff should only go up about 33-40% (33 gems 7 gear? Haven't actually calculated that much on it, but gear shouldn't affect too much)


    Speedrunner quality - Some of the runners in that video were only trained and rushed on, so we could even form a team, essentially unexperienced players.


    Strategies - If you think the swaps/strategies we used were actual ones people would really use nowadays on speed, you'd be wrong, but since there is still competition on live, I didn't want to record actual strats and then put em on the forums.


    All of this combined means that our time is nowhere near the actual times you'll see if this update drops, I'm guessing sub10, probably sub8 with true strats.



    The point I made with speedrunning being "dead", was more of the meaning dead creatively - Everyone running 2 classes, Rev and GS, if you ever speedran before the class reworks started coming in, the meta was set in stone and couldn't be changed. Some think that's great, but frankly, it's boring and it allows for less creative strategies, over all it'll push people away further. Especially the end-game that hate playing GS because it was OP before, guess how they'll think now.
    --> Stats <-- (Updated 21/01/18)

  8. #28
    I've been doing some calc's and it's not really that big of an issue. A few classes can still compete as 1 of's, but it really hasn't changed much from before. It's not even really just Berserk, the amount of new gems makes the runs faster as well. I don't think it needs a nerf.

  9. #29
    Simple solution

    In Shadow Tower

    1 of Class - Class does normal damage +100% damage
    2 of Class - Class does normal damage +50% damage
    3 of Class - Class does normal damage
    4 of Class - Class does normal damage -50% damage
    5 of Class - Class does normal damage -75% damage
    6 of Class - Class does normal damage -99% damage

  10. #30
    Member smellyalater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkDestroyer View Post
    I've been doing some calc's and it's not really that big of an issue. A few classes can still compete as 1 of's, but it really hasn't changed much from before. It's not even really just Berserk, the amount of new gems makes the runs faster as well. I don't think it needs a nerf.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbzRBnlizBg


    The stats are near identical, except ~500 MD, 3 CD and 3 AS, which is neglible in STs and AS is overshadowed once the gem triggers.


    Not sure what "calcs" you've done, but they're wrong, share em if you'd like to prove me otherwise.
    --> Stats <-- (Updated 21/01/18)

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