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Thread: Ice Sage Rework is underwhelming.

  1. #1
    Senior Member LippyLapras's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Ice Sage Rework is underwhelming.

    After looking at the numbers from the patch notes and being initially impressed. I decided to check the rework out in-game just to see how effective this class would be at the end-game level. I tested the Ice Sage's power in terms of U9 farming, shadow tower presence, and just overall enjoyment with the class' new kit. My feedback will go in order of class abilities, beginning with auto attack and ending with the ultimate. At the end, I'll provide another summary describing my overall opinion of the class, followed by some proposed changes to hopefully bring it in line with the other big dps contenders.



    The auto attack is pretty much the Ice Sage's only saving grace. However, with this new attack there are some downsides, the main downside being that Energy Regeneration has practically been rendered useless. Icicle Crash is still a useless ability, being outdamaged and completely outclassed by the auto attack after getting the class gem. Without the class gem, Icicle Crash is only good for killing weak groups of mobs.

    As said previously, Icicle Crash isn't exactly anything to brag about. Once you get your class gem, there is absolutely ZERO reason to use Icicle Crash due to the AoE that comes with your auto attack along with the vastly increased damage. The range on the ability is incredibly short, it has a delayed damage window, and is really only useful before you have the class gem and you're fighting a group of weak mobs. If you have your class gem, don't use this ability, ever.

    After getting your class gem, and most of the time even before getting it, The Big Chill will be your main use of energy. The ability is a great crowd control ability that is good for getting out of a sticky situation and getting some free auto attack damage. If you're looking at the damage that the ability alone puts out, look the other way, because it isn't much to brag about. Use it against a boss or a group of enemies at the beginning of a fight and things will go pretty smoothly. In my opinion this ability is fine where it is, and is a pretty good upgrade for the Ice Sage's kit.

    The Ice Sage's "new" Ultimate ability, Frozen Ward, is good. Though there are some bits of it that are a little strange, though not bad. In terms of a damage buff, this ability is great! It gives the Ice Sage a short burst of some highly increased damage, though this damage does not compete much with Gunslinger ult, or even the Dracolyte with all minions active. The reduced damage is great, though considering the absolutely massive amount of damage you take in u9 and ultra shadow towers, it still doesn't help you survive all too well against those massive attacks that you sometimes just can't dodge, or even see for that matter. The movement speed buff makes you Sanic levels of speed, though running away compared to using the ability to do more damage just seems like a waste when you can just use The Big Chill to get away instead. Add that with the fact that you're not exactly always in the most open of areas, and the movement speed buff just seems even more average.

    Combined with the Ice Sage's class gem, the ultimate ability does wonders for both single target and aoe damage. Though even then, your friendly neighborhood Dracolute or Gunslinger can easily come around and 1-up you without a second thought or effort.

    ---------- OVERALL THOUGHTS----------

    To give a brief summary, the class is underwhelming. While the Ice Sage's damage is definitely improved, it still falls short of the goal of being in-line with other DPS classes.

    The Ice Sage DPS has been increased to be more in line with the other classes in Trove.
    While I'd like to say it's in a good place, it's not. If you're looking for another competitor when it comes to the Dynamic Gunslinger / Draco duo, look the other way, because unfortunately, the Ice Sage still has a long way to go if it wants to compete with them.

    ----------PROPOSED CHANGES----------

    AUTO ATTACK


    No Changes**
    ** I personally think the auto attack is fine, however, if changes to Pain Freeze cannot be made, then I would suggest maybe an extra 20% damage increase to hopefully compensate.

    PAIN FREEZE

    I don't know if it's a bug or not, but when using Pain Freeze, the third attack against will make the enemy explode. However, every FOURTH attack thereafter will trigger the explosion instead of the third.

    The Explosion effect from Big Freeze occurs on every attack / every second attack.
    Currently, the Ice Sage lacks in damage compared to even the Revenant, a tanking class. With the explosion occurring more often, the Ice Sage will be able to shine in both aoe and single target situations. And maybe even beat the Revenant in U9 farming. Seriously, the REVENANT is a faster u9 farmer than the Ice Sage currently. Even with the rework.

    THE BIG CHILL


    Enemies frozen by the Big Chill take 10% extra damage.
    There aren't many changes that I can suggest for this ability, crowd control isn't exactly something that has been particularly needed in this game nor frequently requested. While useful in niche situations, it's good for surviving solo encounters and getting free damage on grouped enemies.

    ICE CRASH


    Damage of Ice Crash increased by 100%. Area of Effect increased by 50%. Also turns water blocks to ice for a short time.
    No. I'm not joking. Ice Crash in it's current state is garbage. There's no reason to have energy regeneration on the Ice Sage at mid to endgame simply because Ice Crash is so garbage.
    There's no reason to use the ability in single target situations at all and if you're using it on a single target after getting your class gem you're just trolling. After getting your class gem, if you're using Ice Crash on groups of enemies, you're trolling. The only use for Ice Crash is against groups of weak mobs before you get your class gem. With this proposed change, Ice Crash will have a use before AND after getting your class gem, being the more beneficial ability to use against large groups of enemies.

    Here's a thing. My Ice Sage and Revenant both have 100% crit chance and 900% crit damage. Revenant has 150k physical damage while Ice Sage has 147k, tried to keep it even.

    Ice Crash damage > 6.5 million.

    Revenant AUTO ATTACK damage > ... 6.5 million.

    What.

    Also, I can turn LAVA into WATER but not WATER into ICE? Physics plz. My Science hurts.
    Also my immersion.

    FROZEN WARD


    Active Time increased by 100% from 6 seconds to 12 seconds.
    While this ability is certainly strong, it doesn't have the same amount of impact on the class that Run n' Gun and Avatar of Flame have on their respective classes. Frozen Ward lasts 6 seconds while Run n' Gun and Avatar last for 10 and 15 seconds respectively. Avatar of Flame also has a 50% damage reduction, as well as adding HR, stability, and extra damage, all while lasting more than twice as long as Frozen Ward. Frozen Ward however does not provide nearly the same amount of damage as Run n' Gun, hence why it should last a little bit longer than Run n' Gun.

    RANT IS OVER.


    Now I don't know all the math that goes into this, I'm just providing what I believe would result in the numbers that should come out of Ice Sage. Assuming the goal is to bring Ice Sage in line with Draco and Gunslinger, the mark was missed. The Ice Sage needs a little more oomph to bring it in line with those classes, as even the Revenant currently outclasses Ice Sage in certain situations. I hope you take these changes into consideration, else the Ice Sage will quickly be overlooked once again with very few actual competitive uses, still leaving Draco, Gunslinger, and Pirate as the best choices for DPS use.
    IGN: LippyLapras | Reddit: LippyLapras | Trove Creations Reddit

  2. #2
    Senior Member Sepulcro's Avatar
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    I (since I started using ice sage back in beta) always spamed both right and left mouse buttons at the same time... So you get benefits from both attacks.

  3. #3
    Senior Member LippyLapras's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sepulcro View Post
    I (since I started using ice sage back in beta) always spamed both right and left mouse buttons at the same time... So you get benefits from both attacks.
    The problem with this is that it delays your auto attacks in favor of the other ability, thus delaying your Pain Freeze explosions.
    IGN: LippyLapras | Reddit: LippyLapras | Trove Creations Reddit

  4. #4
    Senior Member kaizer killer's Avatar
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    Still surprised with ice crash they haven't made it split into shards for more aoe given its a chunk of ice and bit short on range. Next option would have a few fall down in a row up to create range

  5. #5
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    Ice Sage was my first class to level 30. I must admit these new changes are... underwhelming to say the least. I miss the fan spray from the previous empowered gem, distance attack ftw. I also dislike how the shield only blocks 50% of damage versus 100% before. I like to use this class against DD in Shadow tower as a tank to control its OP laser hits.


    With the current changes I will be forced to play like I did before I had a class gem... hiding on ledges and doing my best to safe spot monsters, and under no condition will I enter DD in ST with this class.... I like the increase in damage but it still doesn't match to what my Gunslinger of Dracolyte can do.


    Not sure what to recommend for a fit but I wish you good luck.
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  6. #6
    Senior Member ClumsyBee's Avatar
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    This is a nerf tbh, the only thing i can do now is holding M1 throughout the fight, M2 turned into melee, skill #1 is completely useless, the shield is close to non-existen with massive cooldown time. I guess that they don't want ice sage to be an OP tanker in DD and i do agree i don't like the class being played that way but this rework is just underwhelming in many different ways.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Tortorion's Avatar
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    Making Ice Crash a toggleable skilk that auto-aim on closest enemy would help so much, maybe even too much. Who know.

    Unfortunately it will be similar to a Revenant's skill and not everyone may like it.

    As a bonus: Ultimate skill could increase attack speed of Ice Crash, making them to auto-spawn much faster.

  8. #8
    I agree with Lippy, the new abillities are nice, but they need more damage/duration. The old class gem is useless.. I mean, tanking DD with ice sage is even easier right now, I tested it, 26k full dps ice sage could solo ultra DD with no problem

  9. #9
    Junior Member Ssschah's Avatar
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    I wholeheartedly agree with Lippy and other people that commented before me.
    The rework looks nice but it's just disappointing...
    It doesn't even fix the Ice Crash short range problem that is forcing Ice Sage into awkward middle (almost close) range attack. The other thing is that The Big Chill still doesn't freeze ST bosses which makes this ability useless against them.

    I have 2 things I would like to add to suggested improvements:
    - at least triple the castable range of Ice Crash - the current 5 blocks range is way to short; 15 blocks still aren't much but it's almost a half of the IS auto attack range (28/29 blocks)
    - let The Big Chill freeze ST bosses - let it at least freeze them for 2s (if the full 3.5s would be too op)

  10. #10
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    Ditto,
    The damage increase does not match the defense abilities removed. It's a glass cannon without DPS.

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