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  Click here to go to the first Trove Team post in this thread.   Thread: Bomber Royale Discussion

  1. #1

    Exclamation Bomber Royale Discussion


    Introduction

    So, after playing over 340 BR matches on live, and a fair amount on PTS, I thought It’d be a good idea to start a discussion about BR. This will include, but is not limited to my perception of the game mode, feedback on certain design decisions (from many different players) and a general overview of some major technical issues (many of which have been discussed during PTS).


    All things considered, the overall Bomber Royale design is well executed. The fast paced & engaging combat can be ridiculously fun and plainly addicting once you have a decent grasp of the mechanics. If you haven't played the game mode yet, I strongly suggest giving it a try before you continue reading.

    With all that, as with any system, there’s room for improvement and this is no exception. There’s some underlying technical issues and general oversights that occasionally make matches an absolute headache to play and I'd like to go over several in an attempt to start a discussion and raise awareness.

    The following opinion pieces are in no particular order. As it should be assumed, all given suggestions are simply ideas, and if nothing else, conversation starters. The entire thread is subject to change.

    Feedback

    • Kill qualifications

    There’s two fundamental problems with how kills are awarded. Firstly, only killing blows matters, as there’s no damage dealt or kill assist stat tracking. Secondly, kills don’t count if players die by environmental circumstances, including falling out of the map or by lava, both of which happen frequently.

    There’s nothing more frustrating than spending time on a kill only to have someone else steal it from you, and get zero acknowledgement for your effort, especially when you have to utilize very imprecise attacks such as Rubber & Sticky Bombs. At least if there was damage a dealt stat, it could give an accurate representation of what you’ve actually done in the match, regardless if someone kill steals.

    Speaking of effort put in, a similar circumstance applies to environmental deaths. It doesn’t make sense to me that if a player dies by lava or falling to the void, that the kill isn’t granted to the last person who attacked the player. In most cases (aside from when they kill themselves) you’re still putting in the work, especially if you’re the one to knock them out of the map or into lava.

    Suggestions:

    1. Introduce damage dealt, or an less accurate representation, kill assist stat into the scoreboard & /stats command.

    2. Add a “damage flag” to players that lasts for x seconds, so if they die by environmental circumstances, the last player who dealt damage gets the kill, as long as it’s within the allotted time.
    • Map degeneration

    While this is partly the fault of a few bugs for how unclear map degeneration can be, it doesn’t excuse the fact that there’s not prompt which indicates when and where blocks will begin to despawn, aside from clearly seeing it for yourself, which isn’t always possible.

    While this isn’t particularly a major issue (as long as you’re paying attention) it does seem unusual for a Royale type game-mode to not at least have prompt or countdown when the map starts to degrade.

    Suggestions:

    1. Chat callout every time the map begins to despawn.

    2. Incorporate a UI countdown.

    3. Similar to the VFX shield in the Geode Hub, have something similar for BR that shrinks over time.

    4. While unlikely, have the map show what area is currently under affect.
    • Lava Bomb power-up

    With no limitations or restrictions on the lava bomb power-up, if enough players use them in the right places, it can engulf the entire map rather quickly.

    While it seems intentional, it does make certain maps a bit difficult to play in, especially on the floating islands map, where there's already limited space and if enough are used, can cause some performance issues for certain players.

    Suggestions:

    1. Make lava despawn after a short period of time (15-30s), similar to one of the cave critters in Geode which temporarily replaces blocks at your feet with cave milk.

    2. Improve the differentiation between rubber & lava bombs icons and models, as they both share similar color schemes.

    3. Change the projectile trajectory path color so it’s clear which bomb you’re using without having to look at your hotbar.
    • Vertical jump-pads

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/00tv7yajf3...25-19.mp4?dl=0

    A camper’s best friend. The majority of my games, I’ve witnessed players obsessively camp on jump-pads. It’s an extremely convenient tool, as it’s next to impossible to hit someone off without using Bomb Jump or getting lucky with a well timed bomb, only for them to jump right back on.

    Suggestions:

    1. Allow the lava power-up to spawn ON TOP of jump-pads. Currently, the power-up does not affect jump-pads, but with this change in combination with the temporary lava suggestion would give players another tool to approach campers while also not entirely removing or making jump-pads obsolete.

    2. Make them destructible by sticky bombs. While not necessarily the best option, if the durability was high enough, where it demanded a serious amount of damage, it could potentially be feasible.

    3. Once the map fully degenerates, despawn all remaining jump-pads incase the first two options aren’t possible towards the end of a match.
    • Water

    Fairly self-explanatory, by design, players may utilize water that comes from Face of Flows, an object that’s toggleable & destructible to their advantage. The primary benefit is to give players a second chance if they fall off the map.

    While I do think the idea is in good faith, I’ve frequently encountered scenarios where players will often jump in the water and wait out the majority, if not the entirety of the match by simply staying in the water. While risky, depending on how the map degenerates, you can go to the lowest point of flowing water and hide until you qualify for bronze & possibly even silver tier without the need to ever throw a bomb.

    bronze: top 10 players
    silver: top 4
    gold: 1st


    I’ve always interpreted this game mode as a hybrid of your traditional solo BR’s and a Minecraft spleef-asque gamemode, where the object is fairly simple, you knock someone off (or kill), that’s it. They move on and play again, there is no second, or in our case third or fourth chance. We’re already given two abilities, the Grappling Hook & Bomb Jump which can BOTH be used as a way to save yourself from death. The argument I’ve heard from you guys, the developers, was that water could be used to your advantage, but it just seems unnecessary and if anything else, simply prolongs the matches.

    Suggestions:

    1. Spawn the map blueprint at the lowest possible Y value, near the void. This prevents water flowing down ridiculously far, as well as limits the ability to easily hide in water.

    2. Remove the water entirely & redesign some portions of the map. Not really the ideal suggestion, but a possible quick alternative.

    3. Once the map stops degenerating, despawn all remaining water/Face of Flow’s from the map. This doesn’t solve the issue I proposed above, but it addresses the end portion of a match, where players will simply wait it out, regardless if there’s only two people left in the match.

    4. Exclusively disable water jump reset for BR.
    • Alternate accounts/bots

    The following is purely for demonstration purposes. Those involved in the pictures provided have already been reported.

    https://imgur.com/a/qhex7sn

    To piggyback off what I mentioned above, this sort of behavior is possible because the only qualification for bronze and silver rewards is to stay alive, and while that’s not necessarily a problem, it’s clear that players are taking advantage.

    If someone is capable of filling a major portion (+50%) of a match with alt accounts, as demonstrated in the album, there’s a very a high chance you’ll at least qualify for bronze tier without doing anything. Even if the majority of your accounts die, it’s inevitable that they’ll still place in the top 10. Now, while you’d only get 1 coin per round, per account, if you automate this entire process, it really doesn’t matter how long it takes, it would still be worthwhile if 2-3 accounts are regularly obtaining bronze, and heavily profitable with the current reward prices.

    Suggestions:

    1. Add a report feature to the results UI so it’s easy to officially report someone without going through additional channels.

    2. Cast a silhouette on players (similar to the SH passive for mobs) who've been stationary for an unusually long period of time.

    3. Temporarily restrict players from joining additional BR games if they’re flagged as AFK.
    Bugs

    1. “Ghost block effect”, whereby despawned blocks don’t correctly disappear client-side. This frequently happens the further you are from the affected area.

    2. Similar to when gear falls too far from the original spawn point, Bomber Royale power-ups will bug out and not render correctly. This does not affect the ability to pick them up.

    3. Possible to use bombs before a match begins.

    4. Extremely rare occurrence where most abilities don’t function. Bombs disappear once they land, and the hook doesn’t grapple. Only ability that functions is Bomb Jump, but does not damage.

    5. Instead of normal circumstances, where a portion of the map is left after the map degenerates, there are rare instances where even the last small chunk of map will disappear, forcing the last few players alive to fall to their deaths, whereby the one who falls last wins.

    6. Possible to have water sources that don't require Face of Flows, which can't be destroyed unless you have Lava Bombs.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Arion4K's Avatar
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    Perfectly summed up.

    Now all we need to do is to raise awareness, so if everyone can "cry" about it, they'll fix it. This mode has a lot of potential and honestly it's really fun, I can't imagine how good it could get with the feedback Comply provided <3

    I guess, you guys could express your frustrations from the BR mode pushing Trion to creating a better experience for it's users.

    IGN : Arion4K | Leader of Laezaria

  3. #3
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    I agree, good suggestions and reports. Trion should read this topic and think about the possibilities of how to improve BR.

  4.   Click here to go to the next Trove Team post in this thread.   #4
    Community Manager Fasti's Avatar
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    This is great feedback, thank you! I'm sending it to the folks in charge of BR so they can take a peek.
    Steve "Fasti" Haines
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  5. #5
    Member Boldsen's Avatar
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    Good points, too many exploits in the current state that it quickly get's annoying to play it.
    hi

  6. #6
    Senior Member Sepulcro's Avatar
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    This is THE best feedback I've ever read on this forum! Thank you for raising the bar!

  7. #7
    Senior Member Chronozilla's Avatar
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    Glad you've taken the time to write this, I've had my nose way too deep in Geode and doing all that feedback talk to really know heads or tails in bomber, and you clearly have the experience to support your words. I'd personally really like to see the edge of map shield and the sudden death jump pad removal.
    IGN: Chronozilla | Mastery: 87,316 | Total Power Rank: 340,562 | Alpha Conqueror | Gem Augment Info | Gem Rerolling Issue | Trion Support
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  8. #8
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    You may not like it but this is what peak performance looks like. Trion put mastery behind pvp like the player base didn't want so players played the hand they were dealt.

    You've only reported players colluding with themselves, how will you handle "wts (20) bomber first blocks, 50K"? Why take 11+hrs for a dragon to wait to quit at top10, in a mode you don't like, when you can pay someone to die for you quickly.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Lunar View Post
    You may not like it but this is what peak performance looks like. Trion put mastery behind pvp like the player base didn't want so players played the hand they were dealt.

    You've only reported players colluding with themselves, how will you handle "wts (20) bomber first blocks, 50K"? Why take 11+hrs for a dragon to wait to quit at top10, in a mode you don't like, when you can pay someone to die for you quickly.
    Was this run through google translate? I have absolutely zero clue what this response means.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Comply View Post
    Was this run through google translate? I have absolutely zero clue what this response means.
    It's an effort to reward issue. The required time doesn't pay off to win the match for various reasons you already mentioned. Some choose to sell those items or do activities that don't seem like fair-play to avoid those issues. I belive it's Trions misjudement to put mastery or stats on the items, it breeds this kind of activity.

    It's a different flavor of enemy farms, they were all the rage during Adventures because the player felt the effort to reward was unreasonable with the options they had.

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